If the foundations be destroyed, what can the righteous do?
If word has not gotten around yet that I have gone apostate and have denied the Faith, I want to personally give you my testimony concerning the Trinity Doctrine. I realize that even THINKING of indulging such a thought to see if it is true or not is a NO NO among mainstream Christianity. Anyone knows that to touch this subject is like trying to handle a hot potato and risks being ostracize by his peers. Words do not need to be straightforward to realize that there now resides a rift between relationships.
We know that when we come to reveal opposing views of doctrines that have been taught for hundreds of years without question and accepted as the norm, we usually end up with knee-jerk reactions by those who have held to these doctrines they have been taught. The end result is that the person opposing a doctrine taught for so long ends up at the end of a stick, whipped with name calling, loses relationships, and even going so far as to be told they are not Christians but rather a child of the devil and not really saved.
One of the dogmas my eyes were opened to was the false teaching of Original Sin and a lot of others followed such as the false teaching of Once Saved, Always Saved, Substitution, Pre-Trib Rapture, etc.. Now it seems the journey in my life is to investigate this doctrine of the Trinity, a doctrine by main stream Christianity that we dare not question.
I am not saying I have all the answers, but it does leave room for a lot of questions – questions that have bugged me for a long time, but since I have been programed that this topic is not up for discussion, I have always laid the issue aside as a no big deal. But lately, I have been giving it some serious thought.
Some hard questions we must ask ourselves if we hold to the Trinity doctrine:
- Where in the Bible does it state that if one does not believe in the Trinity, they are not saved?
- Where in the Bible does it say Jesus is fully human as well as FULLY GOD?
- Where in Scripture does it say “God the Son?”
- Since Jesus died on the cross, WHEN DID GOD DIE? Can God die? Not according to Scripture. If Jesus were fully God at the same time being fully human, then the only conclusion is that 1/3 of God died. There is no way around this.
- If Jesus was fully God, then Jesus had an advantage over us and could not sin because He is God. How does this help me to understand Jesus was tempted in all points as we are when God cannot be tempted?
- If Jesus is God and and the Holy Spirit is God, why is speaking against Jesus (God) a sin that can be forgiven, but speaking against the Holy Spirit (God) is a sin that can never be forgiven? So in essence, we must really say, If we blaspheme God it is a forgivable sin, but if we blaspheme God is not forgivable.
- If the Holy Spirit is God and supposedly a person, then why is the Holy Spirit not worshipped? Why is 1/3 of God left out of this equation if the Holy Spirit is God?
I was brought up Catholic and even joined the convent at one time, so when it comes to the doctrine of the Trinity, this is all I have ever known, and in the Protestant world as well – that there are three persons in One God.
Read Rom. 8:15
The Bible tells us that those who are born again that they have God as their Father.
- If God is a trinity of co-equal persons, then why does only one person become our Father when all three are in relationship with us?
- If “God the Son” and “God the Holy Spirit” our not our Father as well, then what are they in relation to us when we receive the Spirit of adoption?
- If one person became our Father, then should not the other two be our Father as well since they are co-equally our God?
Another one. See Mark 13:32. Absolutely no one knows the return of Christ except the Father. It is understandable that Christ would not know, but there is a person missing. What is missing is the co-equal person of the trinity – the Holy Spirit.
- What would be the reason for Jesus leaving him out?
- Is not the Holy Spirit supposed to be equal in knowledge with the Father since we are taught God is omniscient?
- If the Spirit is a distinct co-equal person, why is he not mentioned as knowing the time of Christ’s return?
Read 1 Tim. 5:21. Notice here that Paul charged Timothy before (in the presence of) God, and the Lord Jesus Christ, and the elect angels. “God,” as in the Father, which is obvious. What did Paul fail to mention? Again, it is the Holy Spirit. The Holy Spirit is left out of the equation.
If the Holy Spirit is indeed a distinct person in the trinity, then why is he not mentioned being in the presence of Paul and Timothy along with the rest of the heavenly hosts? Is he not important as the others?
Read John 17:3. Notice Jesus states that to receive eternal life, we only have to know the Father and the Son. If we believe in the trinity, should we not have a problem because Jesus seems to have forgotten to mention the third co-equal person, the Holy Spirit?
Since the doctrine of the trinity believes that the Spirit is a distinct person, then isn’t eternal life by knowing the Holy Spirit as well? Why is it absent from Scripture?
When it comes to the Trinity, it is interesting to see people try to explain what they say is unexplainable and a mystery. When they can’t explain it, then how is the person they are teaching able to understand it? Everybody ends up trying to explain something they don’t understand and we end up with a lot of people who try to explain what they say is unexplainable! I’ve been there!
There is more!
“Let no one say when he is tempted, “I am tempted by God”; for God cannot be tempted by evil, nor does He Himself tempt anyone.”
It is clear that God cannot be tempted. It would not be up for debate. Now, if God cannot be tempted, how do we explain to others that Jesus is God when Scripture clearly tells us God cannot be tempted and Jesus was tempted?
We end up doing a lot of explaining to get past the clear passages of Scripture concerning this topic.
I will say this and I have never admitted it to another person except recently. When I would sometimes pray, I would be somewhat confused. Am I praying to Jesus, am I praying to God? Am I praying to all three, and why pray in Jesus’ name if all three are God?
It is not one thing that has led me to investigate this issue of the Trinity, but it was a culmination of things that I have studied that has brought me to this point. I also saw a clipping that really got my attention. When Jesus said to Peter, “Whom do men say that I am? Was Peter’s response the following?
“Thou are the Logos, existing in the Father as His rationality and then, by an act of His will, being generated, in consideration of the various functions by which God is related to his creation, but only on the fact that Scripture speaks of a Father, and a Son, and a Holy Spirit, each member of the Trinity being coequal with every other member, and each acting inseparably with and interpenetrating every other member, with only an economic subordination within God, but causing no division which would make the substance no longer simple.”
And Jesus answering, said, “What?”
Peter’s simple answer was,
Thou art Christ, THE SON of the living God.
And how did Jesus answer?
Jesus answered and said to him, You are blessed, Simon, son of Jonah, for flesh and blood did not reveal it to you, but My Father in Heaven. Mat 16:17
Many have accused me of defecting from the faith and someone just recently reminded me that not long ago I was defending the Trinity doctrine. Yes, that is true that I did defend the Trinity doctrine. I also at one time defended the OSAS doctrine, the Pre-trib doctrine, Original sin doctrine. The same person that accuses me, does he not remember when he defended certain doctrines that were not biblical?
When God, the Father, reveals truth to us, we cannot turn away from it. Many are content with staying in the “safe zone” rather than search the Scriptures. God never chastises anyone for studying His word. As another brother well stated, “Our past statements should not influence our acceptance of current light or truth.” So I’m sure none of us, when we have been given further light, would not want our past beliefs held against us. It’s not easy eating humble pie when we realize we have been in error and must correct it.
One of the things I have noticed is that not one of the questions above are addressed.
I might add this. James says,
…you believe that GOD IS ONE you do well; the demons also believe, and shudder.
This might sound offensive, but it’s a shame that the demons know who Jesus is more than us Christians.
There is not one single instance of the many recorded examples of Jesus’ casting out of demons where the demons ever even hinted that he is God. Not one. They addressed Jesus as:
The Holy One of God
The Son of God
The Son of the Most High God
The Messiah (Christ)
The Son of God Most High
It is true we don’t get our truth from demons, but what they said it truth. Like James says, “you believe that GOD IS ONE you do well; the demons also believe, and shudder.”
Even demons believe God is one.
Calling Jesus “Messiah,” “Lord Messiah,” “the Lord Jesus,” “the Lord Jesus Christ,” or “our Lord Jesus Christ” was a common practice among the early believers.
However, calling Jesus “the Lord God,” “the Lord our God,” or “the Almighty” are Biblical titles exclusively for the Father OF Jesus and were never practiced by the early believers in reference to Jesus.
Jesus was never referred to as “God the Son.”
When I came upon knowing the teaching of Original sin was false, I knew in my spirit it was correct. When I tried to share this with my friends, they shunned me and called me all kinds of names. I was not yet well equipped to answer all their objections and it took me about two years of study with this issue because of the centuries of what has been taught and taken for granted. It is the same with this issue. As I said above, I don’t have all the answers, and doubt if I ever will, but I trust the Holy Spirit will guide me. I will share things as I go along in this study. What I don’t need is for someone to spam me or try and convince me the Trinity is Biblical since I have already been there and know all about the teaching of this doctrine. Remember, I once defended it.
Thank you for your patience.